Ns 3.0 Thoughts

[lolfighter]

This sums up the problems with electricity better than anything else.

OUR HIVE IS UNDER ATTACK!

THAT is clearly too much! :blink:

[Malevolent]

Oh, I'm glad you got that screenshot Bob. That was so hilarious when it happened. There were so many funny things that happened yesterday.

[Isamil]

The hive did die, but thats beacuse a guy walked in and shotied it.  I wonder how much damage it did take...

[Satanic Monkey]

Any mappers making co_iceworld? *cough, cough*

[a civilian]

On the nades: It's the old gameplay > realism thing. Sure, it doesn't make sense to only get one and no more until you die. But they're so freaking strong that if you could load up on them then just about any alien chamber would be worthless, falling to nadespam. That's why the GL has a higher cost, and makes the wielder pretty vulnerable, unless they want to GL their feet to take out skulks.

I agree that a marine should not be able to load up on grenades.  That would indeed be folly.  I'm arguing that a marine should be able to gain a new grenade by means other than death.  I don't see how that change would be unbalancing; after all, it can be done in the current version with suicide.

And as far as res whores/res hoarders/whatever you call them: It's the many and obvious bad people who have given the few good ones a bad name here. When someone jumps in, drops no RTs, doesn't save for hive, doesn't even drop a chamber, goes fade/onos ASAP and then whines that no one will drop him DCs/MCs, only to die thirty seconds later and then LEAVE THE GAME... well, that's where the animosity comes from, and it happens far too often. If someone says right off 'guys, I'm a very good fade, if I fade early I'll probably last for the rest of the game, and I'll keep marines distracted and take out elec'ed RTs' and so forth, THAT'S GREAT. Hoard that res buddy, you'll be helping the team.

Well, I don't know how many others share that opinion, but perhaps I'll try that sometime.

[BobTheJanitor]

Well, I don't know how many others share that opinion, but perhaps I'll try that sometime.

Your reputation may be better (worse?) than you think. Too many times have I heard people say 'oh no, that fade is civ, we are SO SCREWED!'

[DumbMarine]

The last time I saw civ as a fade, he was on ... lost? (The one with double as nanogrid) and he spent 90% of the game in there as a fade. First it was 4 LMG marines, then 4 heavy HMG marines, then 6 heavy hmg/gl grenades... that whole game I never saw civ die. Madness. And a good reason why blink should be nerfed!

[Diablus]

LB gets to save for onos without complaints (preemptive: it's not just because it's his server olo bant omg). They're just really GOOD at it, and they help the team a lot.

bob u got some brown stuff on your nose

also civil, on the node philosphy, dropping 1 node in the beginning only helps the team ven more, its like paying 15 res, to gain 1 res per tick, it adds up. If everyone doesnt drop a node besides player(s) saving for hive/chamber u DONT see the higher lifeforms later game. so it works out for the worst, saying that philosophy is the reason why aliens are losing more is contradicting yourself because 2 nodes to support a team of 8 is not going to cut it

[a civilian]

also civil, on the node philosphy, dropping 1 node in the beginning only helps the team ven more, its like paying 15 res, to gain 1 res per tick, it adds up. If everyone doesnt drop a node besides player(s) saving for hive/chamber u DONT see the higher lifeforms later game. so it works out for the worst, saying that philosophy is the reason why aliens are losing more is contradicting yourself because 2 nodes to support a team of 8 is not going to cut it

It doesn't work like that.  It isn't as simple as paying 15 resources to get .25 per second.  To continue receiving resources from resource chambers, you must prevent the marines from destroying them.  And how often does an alien team successfully hold more than perhaps four nodes against a competent marine team in the early game?  Not often, in truth.  Early game marines have better map control than early game aliens.  Unless you are fighting an incompetent marine team, it is wasteful to have the entire team build resource chambers simply because you cannot hope to hold anywhere near all of them.

[Diablus]

so your saying ud rather wait 20 minutes in game as a skulk to go onos because aliens have a team of 8-9 with 1 resource tower..... when u could drop a node, wait 10-15 minutes or even less and go onos..... 5 minutes in NS as of 3.0 beta can mean the difference of LA's storming a hive or HA/HMG storming a hive. i would rather build my rt and know im getting resources and helping the team, then going onos. and dying as usual in 3.0

[a civilian]

I am not.  Of course you need a good portion of the alien team to build resource chambers.  But having the entire or nearly the entire team build resource chambers is a waste.

[Venmoch]

So what it really comes down to is that the aliens need to work as a team MORE than they did previously.

[Isamil]

Aliens just need more hard counters to things.  HA should not be Oh crap HA gg.  We were talking about this in IRC, aliens need uber hive 3 abilities.  Charge should kill A3 LA marines in 1 hit.  Unless the marines are very good(And if they are very good, why did the aliens get 3 hives in the first place?) they can't recover from hive 3.

Oh and diablus, since you start out with 25 res, all you need to go fade is 25 more, that comes preaty fast, faster if you skulk and kill a lot.

[Satiagraha]

I am not.  Of course you need a good portion of the alien team to build resource chambers.  But having the entire or nearly the entire team build resource chambers is a waste.

That's what I say. Depending on who i'm playing with, i'll do either of the two options (fade/onos or RT)i like to have 4-5 RTs in the beginning.  I will also try to get those RTs to be put up on and near the starting hive and the other hive that the rines aren't going after. And yes, I pretty much do let the rines have a hive, while we build up the second and then own them with our '1337' leaping skillz :p

[Satiagraha]

EDIT: Whoops... sorry about the double post, hit quote instead of edit...

Eh, while i'm here, I enjoy being onos, even if we're loosing.  It's fun devouring people and listening to them complain :p .  I need to work on my fade skills though, I usually just save up for n0s.

[a civilian]

So what it really comes down to is that the aliens need to work as a team MORE than they did previously.

Indeed.  Teamwork among the aliens was once prevalent, back in 1.04.  Now, it must be relearned.

Aliens just need more hard counters to things.  HA should not be Oh crap HA gg.  We were talking about this in IRC, aliens need uber hive 3 abilities.  Charge should kill A3 LA marines in 1 hit.  Unless the marines are very good(And if they are very good, why did the aliens get 3 hives in the first place?) they can't recover from hive 3.

The problem with that is that it would mean a full fourth of the alien abilities would never be seen in serious play.  Quite a waste, if you ask me.

In addition, I don't even see any benefits that would be achieved by so greatly increasing the power of the third hive.  It would give the aliens the power to counter late game marine technology, certainly, but three hives should not be necessary to counter any marine technology.  Because of the amount of map control it entails, third hive should only be an accessory.

[Uranium - 235]

Sometimes I think the most obvious way to balance high tech would be to allow webs at hive 2...

[Diablus]

Sometimes I think the most obvious way to balance high tech would be to allow webs at hive 2...

but u need bile bomb ALOT to counter seige attacks on a hive

[Malevolent]

Yes, you must work as a team on aliens now, but if the rines are a good team it won't matter. Today, I played a game when we had 3 hives around 5 times. That's how overpowered rines are. The game kept going back and forth. Every onos we got died sooner or later and the HAs were feared. In the end, since the alien team was more organized and the rines weren't performing to their potential, the aliens would have won (the map changed due to a vote since the game was already over an hour long).

[Uranium - 235]

Sometimes I think the most obvious way to balance high tech would be to allow webs at hive 2...

but u need bile bomb ALOT to counter seige attacks on a hive

I've never seen a gorge actually use bilebomb for anything but attacking solo RTs. Honestly, where there's a siege, there's turrets. Where there's turrets, there's a phase gate. Where there's a siege base with a phase gate, there's a lot of pissed off marines with guns. And a shortranged super-weak attack for a super slow and vulnerable lifeform... eeeh...