Overly Chatty Penguins

The Ready Room => General => Topic started by: SlickWill on March 28, 2005, 04:53:36 PM

Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: SlickWill on March 28, 2005, 04:53:36 PM: Now, this is something that has bothered me for some time and I have finally gotten around to posting it. But before I start, by no mean do I mean this to be a rant, because that would defeat the purpose of the post in the first place. Rather, it is meant to be a start to what I hope will be a serious discussion:

Lame quitting, usually by rines, because the end game is longer, is severely affecting the quality of the LM. Most often it happens before all chance of a win or a competative game is gone, rather only when the game is swung from the lame quitters favor. Now, if it were just a public issue, that cannot be solved and just has to be lived with. But it is not. Rather, a number of regs, res slotters and even some admins, one in particular, do it ALL THE TIME. In fact, they announce it: "bbl, be back in a few", etc. Not only is the game then ruined for the remaining players, but IMO, that is unfair use of RS privelage, especially when non-slotters often struggle to get in games. Then the person with the RS rejoins, kicking someone who hasn't lame quit and played through perhaps a slightly unpleasent series.

Well, I guess I have two points: 1. If you are a reg/RS/admin, don't lame quit, it just ruins games and it has been getting more and more common. 2. If you have a RS, then be a little considerate to those you don't and sit through that extra 5-6 minutes of losing.

Like I said, I don't mean this as a rant, rather I am just putting forth some issues which have been on my mind. Looking forward to some feedback.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: 2_of_8 on March 28, 2005, 04:57:40 PM: One perfect argument to this is that
1) People play for their personal fun, and
2) You can't force people to play a game.

Although, if that player comes back the next map, in 5 minutes, I'm sure that quitting the game before was quite pointless, and detractive to the game.

I can point out a few individuals whom I see quitting quite a lot, and it's not that good that those players always expect a perfect game. Sure, sometimes it'll be dragged out a bit, or sometimes your team won't be cooperating, but in my opinion, you've just got to deal with it, if the problem won't be so long-lasting. If you're going to quit, quit from the start is my say - don't do it mid-game or end-game.

Meh, I g2g now, maybe post something else later.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: LowCrawler on March 28, 2005, 06:51:54 PM: Would you rather them quit? or sit bored in MS and knife everything?
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: 2_of_8 on March 28, 2005, 06:55:30 PM: I don't know, maybe wait it out for a couple of minutes. If the aliens are taking too long, they can be asked to end it faster. If they don't, then an admin could be called, I don't know.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: pardzh on March 28, 2005, 07:09:04 PM: Quote
Would you rather them quit? or sit bored in MS and knife everything?
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I confess that I'm guilty of that sometimes. :o
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: Manta on March 28, 2005, 08:20:16 PM: This is a two-sided issue. On one hand, marines quitting can kind of ruin the game for certain people; however, aliens that take forever to end the game (although marines constantly giving HMGs to the team doesn't help) can contribute to quitters.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: Malevolent on March 28, 2005, 08:27:00 PM: Quote
Would you rather them quit? or sit bored in MS and knife everything?
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I'd love them to do that. I don't get to llama/kick/ban enough people.

But seriously, reserved slotters better not be doing this.

EDIT: Btw, I was referring to the knifing bit.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: SlickWill on March 28, 2005, 08:36:04 PM: Pay attention, you will notice. There are even admins, especially one, who do it all the time. BTW, didn't even say something could be done, just sooo llama. I like having good games and lame quitting at 5 min because you lost a pg isn't good for that.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: Manta on March 28, 2005, 08:51:12 PM: It is kind of lame to quit just because something went wrong. I remember the On|e server having a ban for quitting on a loss or something.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: 2_of_8 on March 28, 2005, 09:04:08 PM: Quote
It is kind of lame to quit just because something went wrong. I remember the On|e server having a ban for quitting on a loss or something.
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I think that's going to far, banning for not playing a game?
Meh. Something lighter, like a plea NOT to quit.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: duherman on March 28, 2005, 10:25:57 PM: I hate it when I get slot-kicked every 5 minutes. It's ironic how it happens everytime I'm about to onos/fade/drop chambers/drop hive.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: 2_of_8 on March 28, 2005, 10:33:18 PM: Quote
I hate it when I get slot-kicked every 5 minutes. It's ironic how it happens everytime I'm about to onos/fade/drop chambers/drop hive.
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Uhh maybe wrong thread? I don't know, this is totally unrelated :|
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: SwiftSpear on March 28, 2005, 11:44:34 PM: If I quit its either because I'm done playing for the time being (rarely until a game is finished will I do this), I'm fed up with llamas, or I have to get off the comp and do something for my mom. Sometimes if it is the latter I will announce that I will be back in a few, I mean no point in holding a slot hostage until my 90second AFK kick if I am only leaving for 10 minutes, but I am not meaning to imply that I am just leaving until the marine loss is finished. If I am on the losing marine team and we are just HMG turtling, I will generally just drop all my guns and try to get some practice in with the knife, either that or I will attemt to form alliances with the aliens and offer to weld things open for them. I don't particularly like prolonging the game so I generally don't go with the crowd on an HMG turtle, but I don't run off with marine res and I don't F4 or tempquit, that is just a lame thing to do.

The only time I just outright quit is if the opposing team is intentionally and maliciously prolonging the game. I'm not going to sit around and wait for the aliens to preform a successfull gorge rush while my team is turtling in MS with HMGs. And IMHO if you are going to drop a 32 chamber WOL on either side of marine start, then you can enjoy having that WOL sit there without me on the server to get killed by it.

Ocationally a prolonged game can be fun, like if the aliens take pet marines or something any make them do things >:D but 9 times out of 10 the prolonged games are just lame as hell.

To recap, quiting because you don't like losing = llama, prolonging game = llama. If you do either you can stop it right away.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: 2_of_8 on March 28, 2005, 11:51:16 PM: I agree completely swift, but the problem is quitting when it's mid-game on the losing team, usually marines.
Meh.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: SwiftSpear on March 28, 2005, 11:54:24 PM: Quote
I agree completely swift, but the problem is quitting when it's mid-game on the losing team, usually marines.
Meh.
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Quiting because your team is losing is lame no matter what. Quitting because your little bro fell down the stairs again midgame while your team just happens to be losing is a little different...
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: 2_of_8 on March 28, 2005, 11:57:53 PM: Quote
Quote
I agree completely swift, but the problem is quitting when it's mid-game on the losing team, usually marines.
Meh.
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Quiting because your team is losing is lame no matter what. Quitting because your little bro fell down the stairs again midgame while your team just happens to be losing is a little different...
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Do you say "gg" and leave when that happens? :)
Because that's a sign of lamequitting.

PS I expect you to finish the game at hand before lending help to your little bro.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: SwiftSpear on March 29, 2005, 12:01:12 AM: Quote
Quote
Quote
I agree completely swift, but the problem is quitting when it's mid-game on the losing team, usually marines.
Meh.
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Quiting because your team is losing is lame no matter what. Quitting because your little bro fell down the stairs again midgame while your team just happens to be losing is a little different...
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Do you say "gg" and leave when that happens? :)
Because that's a sign of lamequitting.

PS I expect you to finish the game at hand before lending help to your little bro.
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No, I usually say "****, GTG, BE BACK IN A FEW"
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: CryForMe on March 29, 2005, 03:33:52 AM: Quote
It is kind of lame to quit just because something went wrong. I remember the On|e server having a ban for quitting on a loss or something.
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thats absolutely right. if we were fast enough to catch you doing that crap, you got a temp ban. it may be harsh, but people get the picture. regulars and admins dont like being banned...at all. so when you've got people in the upper ranks who are lame quitting instead of playing it out, its a strong deterrant. i leave and come back very frequently, but i always do it after the round is over and everyones in the rr. otherwise, i fight to the bitter end, cause thats half the fun. i mean seriously, yesterday the rines were being endgame slaughtered as usual and i spawned in and knifed a fade. wouldnt have caught that kill if i quit. and besides, if you're losing, take solace in the fact that you get another chance in a very few minutes, so just go with it, you might end up having fun doing something like going parasite vs knife with a skulk :)
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: That Annoying Kid on March 29, 2005, 05:32:52 AM: f10 has always been TLM's f4, and there is no logical way to force someone to play a game. Seems as if the circumstances are out of our immediate control...
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: Ubermaus on March 29, 2005, 07:05:48 AM: You can still have fun on a losing team though - seeing how long you can hold the aliens off, maybe, or being determined to take down a damned onos that's been harassing you. Sure, it's not as fun as romping to victory, but there's usually at least some humour over comms to take the dullness out of it.

Also, if you're finding the game less fun just hold on til it ends and a new one starts. It's less fun for the winning team too if everyone quits, since it kind of robs them of a glorious victory.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: Necrosis on March 29, 2005, 08:26:35 AM: Slotters should be held to a higher standard than joe public, so if anything the punishment should be harsher than what we mete out to them.

Its not like slotters don't know better....
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: GrayDuck on March 29, 2005, 08:44:54 AM: This has been discussed before, and yes it is a pain. We can keep people from F4ing and ruining a win for the opposite team – but we cannot force someone to stay in the server and keep playing. And to be honest – I’d rather the serious people keep playing and the one’s who have given up to get the heck out – lately nothing has pissed me off more to see a rine drop his weapons at the 5 min mark and run around with a knife and try to find a hiding spot.

So – Seeing how punishment for people leaving and rejoining later isn’t really something that I see ever happening… I suggest this Slick – you seem to have a list of people in mind that are huge offenders of this. Nothing’s stopping you from posting that. Perhaps a little shame will whip people into shape. I certainly don’t want to be known as ‘that admin who quits when she’s going to lose’ – and gosh, I DO hope I’m not the admin you keep referring to.

I’m sorry, I know that it’s frustrating, and I can see the reasoning behind you wanting admins to take action. But it is just a part of the game that just so happens to have been amplified by the latest release. Try not to let a few bad seeds ruin your fun – I too expect more from our Reserved Slotters and especially my fellow admins.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: duherman on March 29, 2005, 10:27:29 AM: Quote
Quote
I hate it when I get slot-kicked every 5 minutes. It's ironic how it happens everytime I'm about to onos/fade/drop chambers/drop hive.
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Uhh maybe wrong thread? I don't know, this is totally unrelated :|
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I'm one of those people who don't have a slot and get kicked every so and so.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: rad4Christ on March 29, 2005, 10:56:44 AM: I'm probably one of the ones 1/4 refers to when he says "they expect perfect games". Although I have been overall frustrated with the (lack of) teamwork on LM as of late, I do try to stick it out until the end of the round, UNLESS I know I'll do/say something I shouldn't. Then I leave.

I see what SlickWill is saying, and to an extent agree with it. Although, I think there are more issues to deal with. Since F4 is not allowed, end games need to happen faster. That means not saving for HA and JP, or having all three hives and every node. Constantly push, you may be knocked back, you may end the game. You may even waste too much res and sudeenly be on the losign side. Either way, at least you were doing SOMETHING.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: Malevolent on March 29, 2005, 10:57:01 AM: Quote
I hate it when I get slot-kicked every 5 minutes. It's ironic how it happens everytime I'm about to onos/fade/drop chambers/drop hive.
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We know you don't have a slot. Stop comlaining please.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: moofree on March 29, 2005, 12:47:05 PM: I'm guilty of this. Normally when I leave the server, it's after a game is done, but sometimes I just get bored of ns and decide to quit in the middle of a game. Normally this happens when I'm aliens (if this is the case, i'll normally drop a chamber or an rt or something if i have the res)
If i'm marines, i'll drop my non-lmg gun and do an insane run on a hive

I have an idea for a mod that would sort of lessen this problem.

Howabout when a marine leaves, the server autodrops their weapons and armor by the nearest infantry portal
Or when an alien leaves it distributes their res amongst the remaining players... wait.. on second thought, that'd be really exploitable...

On third thought both of these could be exploited easily... you're about to die in a heavy with an hmg so you hit your quit button...
nevermind.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: SlickWill on March 29, 2005, 12:52:54 PM: I won't post a list of those who I see doing this on a regular basis. I think that is a little low and I would rather take the high road. But those who do, they KNOW. So, just be a little bit considerate. I'm done. Thanks for the reads and the input. :)
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: Diablus on March 29, 2005, 01:44:17 PM: I'll admit I am guilty once inawhile for "lame leaving" but I have reasons to back it up and also If im alien, ill drop my res to benefit the team, and as marine ill drop my weapons.

for one When Aliens / Marines make their last stand they're only delaying the inevitable. So rather then wait another 6-10 minutes of the long dragout people such as I would rather leave, go get something to eat, or even play another game.

Would you rather us say go get something to eat or go watch TV afk in game so nobody else could join and hell, even possibly make a comeback? or would you rather us leave, do our own thing and not take up slots? People who leave aren't "soar losers" most of the time, they just are impatient / angry at the team / other reasons and you really cant do anything about that.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: Necrosis on March 29, 2005, 02:03:17 PM: The problem isnt people who drop their guns, or spend their res then leave.

Problem is people who just vanish, with no comment at all.

Leaving and rejoining purely for the next round means the inevitable slotkick of whoever joined when you left. So not only do they join at endgame, they have a bad endgame and then get kicked at the start of the next round. Not a pleasant experience (only applies to people slotkicked by slotters coming back from their quit).

Whenever a game goes badly, keep your spirits up, keep the team spirits up, and try to set a fun little goal for yourself.... a suggestion is trying to relocate to pad, or perhaps recycling everything except the IPs then dropping a lot of shotties in order to rush a hive. Fun is all in the perspective, if the game is lost then try to find fun in some other game related activity.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: Dark on March 29, 2005, 04:31:24 PM: if i'm an alien and have to go i go gorge then drop what i can with my remaining res and then leave. i do hate doing it but sometimes the parental units want me to do something. i get tired of people who don't do what they are supposed to do but i do live with it.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: 2_of_8 on March 29, 2005, 05:25:07 PM: The problem isn't in people leaving due to legitemate reasons, it's people leaving 5 minutes before the end-game, therefore ruining the game.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: Necrosis on March 29, 2005, 06:49:40 PM: I think we should actively try to encourage our teams to finish the game if possible.

IE not waiting for the third hive plus chambers if its not necessary.

Always remember, the key to an early finish is teamwork. A concerted rush, supporting a higher lifeform, running distraction, staying in squads. By promoting one you promote the other, so its all good.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: DarkScythe on March 30, 2005, 01:09:11 AM: i have some comments but i am just way too sleepy to remember what i wanted to say.. lol

anyway, slick, it's a prevalent problem on most servers, not just LM and there really is no countermeasure to it when normal people (non-slots and random pubs that come in) do it, because you can't do anythign to prevent people from quitting.

talking about sportsmanship only applies to regs (slot and nonslot) and admins who frequent this server and understand what everyone else goes through.

i guess i should be happy to say i've never lame-quit any game, as i always see to the end unless i get slotted, or my comp explodes or whatever, but yes it is frustrating.
i've been on both sides, where we're winning, or we just took out a critical part of the opposing team's strategy and the tide turned for us and the other side left making it feel like a hollow victory, as well as the losing side where we're camped out in base waiting for the inevitable and my team quits making it even more impossible for us

i personally only leave either before a new round, or after i finish the round we're currently playing, and sometimes i admit i feel like quitting in the middle of the game or near end-game because it's just frustrating, but i will hold off til the end

i agree, however, the regs and *especially* those that hold reserved slots should take care to try not to do this, because the impact that an RS has is much greater, referring to the fact that a nonslot comes in for a bad endgame then gets slotted the next round, which does happen
but other than that, there's not much that can be done to normal players other than a plea to hold out for another few minutes while u promise to end the game

..do i make sense? i dont know, i'm so sleepy.. night.
Title: Serious issue affecting LM gaming qualitiy.
Post by: Doobie Dan on March 30, 2005, 10:39:45 AM: I sometimes leave at bad points like this, if I get so worked up that it'd be best that I do. I take care not to join again for quite a while though, at least 30 minutes, because otherwise it's F4ing. And this is fairly rare.

However, I have a strict standard to always respect other players. If somebody is pissing me off in game to the point where I'm about to chew them out, I'm going to leave rather than become an asshole myself. Leaving isn't a good thing, but it's a better alternative.